Avali Nexus

(03-03-2016, 06:35 AM)YDH Wrote: [ -> ]It is. The sarcasm is never going away.

...That grin emote will take some getting used to.

I usually disable smilies.

Lots of building today... and lots of putting Avali in cages. :p

(03-12-2016, 02:31 AM)YDH Wrote: [ -> ]Lots of building today... and lots of putting Avali in cages. :p

Oh great.  Something that incites even greater loneliness.

(03-12-2016, 03:30 AM)Lost Rinoah Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-12-2016, 02:31 AM)YDH Wrote: [ -> ]Lots of building today... and lots of putting Avali in cages. :p

Oh great.  Something that incites even greater loneliness.

*Evil grin* They won't be lonely for very long!

A public service announcement for directors: never work with children, animals, or lava.

(03-13-2016, 09:42 PM)YDH Wrote: [ -> ]A public service announcement for directors: never work with children, animals, or lava.

I usually solve the first two with lava though...  It works.  I had someone lock himself in my command room in starbound once.  Flooded the room with lava then drained it and popped the door.  ...  I built an airlock system on my ship.  >.>

If only they had the option to spawn liquids into an area with a reverse drain.  Then I could finally make that trap I've been prototyping for so long without a secondary liquid reservoir that I have to manually reset.  And put a chest of several hundred diamonds behind a second fake chest that activates  doors that close and floods the room with lava that will force them down a hole in the floor into a narrow deep room, hatch on a 1.5 or two second timer...


Stuff is fun yo.

The question is.  Will it blend?

On a serious note.  Unpredictable elements can suck sometimes.

Yeah, I just spent an hour trying to get a room to flood with lava juuust right before finally going "eh, good enough." It took more re-shoots than any other scene...

Anyway. Almost done with episode 4. Should be out within the next couple days.

(03-14-2016, 12:34 AM)YDH Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah, I just spent an hour trying to get a room to flood with lava juuust right before finally going "eh, good enough." It took more re-shoots than any other scene...

Anyway. Almost done with episode 4. Should be out within the next couple days.

Hope it comes out clean as you wanted.

You know, the more I think about it, the more I think that the Avali would never have left the stone age if they hadn't been dragged out of it by the malefactors. First of all, their subzero world would make working with metal a nightmare. I can see an advanced civilization overcoming that problem, but how do you become an advanced civilization without metal? On top of that, most of the surface of Avalon is ice sitting on top of a water ocean--the amount of metal they can actually get to will be severely limited.

Further, they're predators rather than hunter-gatherers and they never domesticated animals. Farming might never have occurred to them on their own, and without farming there's no way they could produce enough excess food to build a civilization where some members have enough free time to devote themselves to, say, inventing or philosophy rather than gathering food day in and day out.

And finally, their lousy eyesight renders the written word clumsy and awkward for them. I recall reading that they use stringed instruments as an analog to writing, but that sounds horribly awkward. I can carry information-dense books like a technical manual or War and Peace around in one hand, but imagine trying to render War and Peace with strings you have to pluck... it would be many meters long! And imagine having to assemble up such a device in the first place!

(03-15-2016, 08:56 PM)YDH Wrote: [ -> ]You know, the more I think about it, the more I think that the Avali would never have left the stone age if they hadn't been dragged out of it by the malefactors. First of all, their subzero world would make working with metal a nightmare. I can see an advanced civilization overcoming that problem, but how do you become an advanced civilization without metal? On top of that, most of the surface of Avalon is ice sitting on top of a water ocean--the amount of metal they can actually get to will be severely limited.

Further, they're predators rather than hunter-gatherers and they never domesticated animals. Farming might never have occurred to them on their own, and without farming there's no way they could produce enough excess food to build a civilization where some members have enough free time to devote themselves to, say, inventing or philosophy rather than gathering food day in and day out.

And finally, their lousy eyesight renders the written word clumsy and awkward for them. I recall reading that they use stringed instruments as an analog to writing, but that sounds horribly awkward. I can carry information-dense books like a technical manual or War and Peace around in one hand, but imagine trying to render War and Peace with strings you have to pluck... it would be many meters long! And imagine having to assemble up such a device in the first place!

Easy.  They would use Lead, gold, copper, metals with a much lower melting temperature.  Although to be honest, at temperatures as low as that.  They wouldn't even need metal, actually.  Frozen liquids that can transmit electricity, materials that melt at temperatures we consider "Room temperature"  We think "Wood" they think "Frozen string coated with heated liquid which is then frozen"  Where do you think their "Bullet proof cloth" stuff came from?  They had kevlar by the time we had hide clothing.  (By time since "creation")

It would allow a VERY different method of developement that would surpass ours in some ways, and...  Not so much in others...

Farming:  It never would have. 

Recorded on instruments and in songs as in history told by the historians.  Their history is told by bards.  Stories passed down from generation to generation until recordings can be made.  Why do you think their benefactors are not remembered?

That's an interesting perspective re: frozen liquids, but what frozen liquids conduct electricity? Water ice doesn't--the freezing process gets rid of the free ions that allow conduction through water (which is, by itself, a poor conductor).

Also, I don't know if you could substitute frozen liquids or gases for metals as a building material--metals are cool and useful because they're hard, but they can also bend, and they can be deformed by partially melting them. You can combine different metals to create substances with specific combinations of conductivity/malleability/hardness, but as far as I know this isn't something you can do with, say, dry ice.

As for metals with a low melting point, that still leaves the question of how you melt it. Fire is out of the question because there's no oxygen in the atmosphere, so the only way I can think of would be to use volcanically active regions, which I assume are very rare on Avalon.

The bulletproof cloth is made from carbon nanofibers--a high-level technology we're still trying to master, and not something stone-age nomads could come up with.

Oral recall of your entire knowledge base is a problem--you can't sing someone a sophisticated and precise diagram or code it into strings. It would be possible to work around these shortcomings, but it makes practically everything much harder. A braille-like language would be more efficient, though still not as compact and portable as graphical symbols. I actually like that idea, so maybe I'll throw out the record harps and use a tactile language instead (even though I think the "musical books" are canon).

The lack of farming is a huge, huge problem. To do things like run a centralized government or invent an internal combustion engine (another thing the low temperature and atmospheric composition of Avalon would render problematic), you need people who have time to devote to such things instead of going out hunting. If everybody's putting all their energy into getting food (and they would be if all their food comes from hunting), no-one will have time to sit down and tinker until they invent algebra. No farming probably means no civilization.

(03-16-2016, 01:48 AM)YDH Wrote: [ -> ]That's an interesting perspective re: frozen liquids, but what frozen liquids conduct electricity? Water ice doesn't--the freezing process gets rid of the free ions that allow conduction through water (which is, by itself, a poor conductor).

Also, I don't know if you could substitute frozen liquids or gases for metals as a building material--metals are cool and useful because they're hard, but they can also bend, and they can be deformed by partially melting them. You can combine different metals to create substances with specific combinations of conductivity/malleability/hardness, but as far as I know this isn't something you can do with, say, dry ice.

As for metals with a low melting point, that still leaves the question of how you melt it. Fire is out of the question because there's no oxygen in the atmosphere, so the only way I can think of would be to use volcanically active regions, which I assume are very rare on Avalon.

The bulletproof cloth is made from carbon nanofibers--a high-level technology we're still trying to master, and not something stone-age nomads could come up with.

Oral recall of your entire knowledge base is a problem--you can't sing someone a sophisticated and precise diagram or code it into strings. It would be possible to work around these shortcomings, but it makes practically everything much harder. A braille-like language would be more efficient, though still not as compact and portable as graphical symbols. I actually like that idea, so maybe I'll throw out the record harps and use a tactile language instead (even though I think the "musical books" are canon).

The lack of farming is a huge, huge problem. To do things like run a centralized government or invent an internal combustion engine (another thing the low temperature and atmospheric composition of Avalon would render problematic), you need people who have time to devote to such things instead of going out hunting. If everybody's putting all their energy into getting food (and they would be if all their food comes from hunting), no-one will have time to sit down and tinker until they invent algebra. No farming probably means no civilization.

Saline solutions do, especially when frozen.  The only issue is it increases the temperature, which makes the liquid moving and chaotic again (thus less effective).  However, when things are "so cold" they don't risk melting, plus with a simple plastic of some sort, or a rubber.  They could make tubes that ran liquid as wires, which could safely transmit electricity without risking anything, as it still conducts as a liquid.  Same effect of our computers overheating, slower transition of electricity and inefficiency.  Remember the term "Electrolytes"?  Stands for water-soluble salts. 

Yes it IS a problem that knowledge is hard to store.  That's why their social advancement is slow despite how social they are to each other within their packs.  Ours is because we're self warring shitheads who hold worthless grudges like imbeciles.

They pass skills between individuals like mother teaches daughter father teaches son or whatnot, they pass important knowledge on in music and song.  Some info is lost from this process up to the point they finally invent their first recording devices.  But it IS the most efficient method of recording up to that point by such a race.  Their first recording devices would likely basic masonic structures amounting to wind chimes until they miniaturize it, and eventually this would allow advancement beyond the medieval stage.  Within their own personal set of how things would advance.  They would try to avoid non ice worlds as it would outright break a lot of their technology.  Just to survive on a volcanic world they'd have to run around in three layer powered armor.  (Cooling layer, insulation layer, layer that won't melt because of the temperature)  True metal use wouldn't really exist by them until they managed to get to space, (discover vacuum, use it to heat metal without destroying their other tech).  Which would be weird to see if they even managed it.  Due to atmospheric friction and use of materials that melt at a MUCH lower temperature.

They would be able to use sharpened ice as a VERY effective blade by simply "Casting" it over a porous material, as I said, like cloth/hide.

So in general.  There ARE issues with them.  And their choice of advancement changes what develops first and in what order.  However they aren't distinctly "non human"  As every single custom they have has been used by us at least at one point in history.  The reason they can't adapt beyond their pack mentality is the bad eyesight coupled with inability to farm normally.  It is surprising how much those two things limit their social structure.  Their eyesight never allowed early things like cave drawing, and things such as that, forcing them to use ONLY music, whereas humans used music and pictures, those pictures eventually getting more intricate with our hearing being not sensitive enough past a cdertain point to distinguish. 

Whereas the Avali adapted music to clicks so subtle that they could increase the efficiency of their music and audio method a lot farther, enabled by their sensitive hearing, far beyond what we can do.  If you want to legitimately torture an Avali.  Play a high pitched binaural tune that is still audible to humans.

New episode!



Fresh off their victory over the murderous Bloodclaw, Yellow and Rhaomi abruptly have the rug pulled out from under them when the mysterious Mengele reappears and kidnaps Yellow. While his purpose is unclear, his methods are obvious: to lay bare the mind of his hapless victim, and show him just the sort of people he’s dealing with. Alone and entirely powerless, can Yellow withstand the withering psychological beating?

(03-16-2016, 11:39 PM)YDH Wrote: [ -> ]New episode!



Fresh off their victory over the murderous Bloodclaw, Yellow and Rhaomi abruptly have the rug pulled out from under them when the mysterious Mengele reappears and kidnaps Yellow. While his purpose is unclear, his methods are obvious: to lay bare the mind of his hapless victim, and show him just the sort of people he’s dealing with. Alone and entirely powerless, can Yellow withstand the withering psychological beating?

Hehehe.  So that's what it looks like when someone who considers themselves sane goes through that type of test.  So easy to effect...  :U

What point is there in fearing anything when we are all so small?  Everyone has to die sometime.  May as well make it feel worthwhile doing so.  Fear leaves us sitting about afraid to accomplish anything, that we might fail.  We needn't pretend it doesn't exist.  Especially when you can turn it to your advantage.  Eh?

I've spent a LOOONG time thinking about such things.  It's fun, nice to see you dabble into it a bit.

That was kind of a heavy video. Here's something silly.



My one-offs run on the Rule of Funny, and as such are not necessarily canon.

I haven't forgotten your posts, either, I just want to put some thought into them before replying.

(03-17-2016, 11:09 PM)YDH Wrote: [ -> ]That was kind of a heavy video. Here's something silly.
~Snippity Snap~
My one-offs run on the Rule of Funny, and as such are not necessarily canon.

I haven't forgotten your posts, either, I just want to put some thought into them before replying.

Aye, well, wanting to live is technically selfish, and wanting to die is even more selfish.  Wanting to live, despite how many people die daily, means you value yourself more than other people, it's standard but it's selfish, however, we all need to be at least slightly selfish, otherwise we end up depressed, and it eventually breaks us.  Eventually some are put into situations where they do not believe they can handle anymore, and they react wildly to it.  They then take the quickest way to escape.  Which is technically saying "Everyone else can deal with this.  I am done."  How you think about it, doesn't in the end change the fact of the matter.  It is done only to help oneself.

I can talk about such things without depression, so, I hope it does not effect you poorly.  As I have studied far worse things. The human psyche, after all.  We are products of the life we live.  The worst life usually leads to the greatest people.  The easiest life, to the worst and weakest.  But generalizations, are never perfect.

On another lighter note.




Need to make sure I don't accidentally make it feel like I*'m trying to hurt someone when I'm not.  So I hope you are okay.

I'm okay, though I'd rather not delve into this subject too deeply.

(03-16-2016, 09:52 PM)Lost Rinoah Wrote: [ -> ]Saline solutions do, especially when frozen.  The only issue is it increases the temperature, which makes the liquid moving and chaotic again (thus less effective). However, when things are "so cold" they don't risk melting, plus with a simple plastic of some sort, or a rubber.

I know salt lowers the freezing point of water and leeches out of sea ice, but I don't know how it interacts with other things that are gaseous at our temperature range. I would assume that salt has a similar effect on other frozen solids, in that it would lower their freezing point by interfering with crystal formaton. Then again, maybe not if the liquid in question is non-polar.

I'm not actually certain what sorts of frozen solids Avali would encounter aside from water ice, all the gases it occurred to me to look up have freezing points that are too cold even for Avali to survive (hundreds of degrees below zero, as opposed to the condensation point of ammonia which is 33 C, which is increased due to Avalon's high pressure and Avali biology. Dry ice, for instance, would probably be too cold for them to handle safely.

Plastics and rubbers as we know them would probably be useless at the Avali temperature range. They both become brittle at such temperatures.

Of course, the question is kind of moot without farming, or maybe aquaculture. No farming means no civilization, no civilization means no advanced machines or materials, and the Avali would have remained divided, scattered stone-age tribes, and if animals and early humans are indicative of what primitive Avali were like, they'd probably be violent. So it seems that despite the horrific things the malefactors did, they also made possible everything that makes it good to be an Avali.

Lost Rinoah

(03-17-2016, 01:20 AM)Lost Rinoah Wrote: [ -> ]Hehehe.  So that's what it looks like when someone who considers themselves sane goes through that type of test.  So easy to effect...  :U

What point is there in fearing anything when we are all so small?  Everyone has to die sometime.  May as well make it feel worthwhile doing so.  Fear leaves us sitting about afraid to accomplish anything, that we might fail.  We needn't pretend it doesn't exist.  Especially when you can turn it to your advantage.  Eh?

I think you're placing too much trust in Mengele's evaluation of Yellow. Assuming his observations are correct, what he says is chosen for careful effect. Add to that the fact that he may be lying, and you can't really put much stock in anything he says. Unfortunately, it's also a bad idea to ignore it out of hand as well. He's that kind of villain.

(03-18-2016, 12:52 AM)Lost Rinoah Wrote: [ -> ]Aye, well, wanting to live is technically selfish, and wanting to die is even more selfish.  Wanting to live, despite how many people die daily, means you value yourself more than other people, it's standard but it's selfish, however, we all need to be at least slightly selfish, otherwise we end up depressed, and it eventually breaks us.  Eventually some are put into situations where they do not believe they can handle anymore, and they react wildly to it.  They then take the quickest way to escape.  Which is technically saying "Everyone else can deal with this.  I am done."  How you think about it, doesn't in the end change the fact of the matter.  It is done only to help oneself.

I get what you're saying about wanting to die being selfish, but I don't think your assertion that wanting to live is selfish necessarily holds. You assert that wanting to live even though other people are dying means you value yourself more than other people, but that is only true when your life contributes to their death. I know that people are dying over in Africa, for instance, but my continued existence does not cause those people to die, at least not in any way we can predict. Quite the contrary, actually--as an environmental scientist in training, I may eventually do work in Africa that helps to save lives, for example assisting people with improved farming practices, managing human-wildlife conflict, or other forms of community development.

Actually. I stated that the selfishness of living is required. If you are completely selfless, bad things happen. And that the only answer is to not think about it too often. We aren't made to think about such things, the human brain is not designed to comprehend such things fully, safely. ^-^

But yeah. Sorry for bringing that up. I get carried away a lot on those subjects. I really do apologize for that.

What I was really trying to say before I got carried away is I have quite a bit of experience on mind games, and with every single thing Mangele had said to Actor Yellow I recognized the patterns of his choice dialogues. I also saw every mistake, and misstep he made in his choice pattern. Which is what I referred to joking about how easy it was to effect Actor Yellow. Those little doubts that started to take seed. Luckily it seems most were uprooted already, but still. It's simply personal experience. So I cannot judge. ;P

(03-18-2016, 01:29 PM)Lost Rinoah Wrote: [ -> ]Actually. I stated that the selfishness of living is required. If you are completely selfless, bad things happen. And that the only answer is to not think about it too often. We aren't made to think about such things, the human brain is not designed to comprehend such things fully, safely. ^-^

Yeah, I understood that you said that this "selfishness" is necessary, but I still don't think the word "selfishness" really fits here for the reasons I listed above.

(03-18-2016, 01:29 PM)Lost Rinoah Wrote: [ -> ]What I was really trying to say before I got carried away is I have quite a bit of experience on mind games, and with every single thing Mangele had said to Actor Yellow I recognized the patterns of his choice dialogues. I also saw every mistake, and misstep he made in his choice pattern.

Are you sure they were mistakes? :p

(03-16-2016, 01:48 AM)YDH Wrote: [ -> ]That's an interesting perspective re: frozen liquids, but what frozen liquids conduct electricity? Water ice doesn't--the freezing process gets rid of the free ions that allow conduction through water (which is, by itself, a poor conductor).

Also, I don't know if you could substitute frozen liquids or gases for metals as a building material--metals are cool and useful because they're hard, but they can also bend, and they can be deformed by partially melting them. You can combine different metals to create substances with specific combinations of conductivity/malleability/hardness, but as far as I know this isn't something you can do with, say, dry ice.

As for metals with a low melting point, that still leaves the question of how you melt it. Fire is out of the question because there's no oxygen in the atmosphere, so the only way I can think of would be to use volcanically active regions, which I assume are very rare on Avalon.

The bulletproof cloth is made from carbon nanofibers--a high-level technology we're still trying to master, and not something stone-age nomads could come up with.

Oral recall of your entire knowledge base is a problem--you can't sing someone a sophisticated and precise diagram or code it into strings. It would be possible to work around these shortcomings, but it makes practically everything much harder. A braille-like language would be more efficient, though still not as compact and portable as graphical symbols. I actually like that idea, so maybe I'll throw out the record harps and use a tactile language instead (even though I think the "musical books" are canon).

The lack of farming is a huge, huge problem. To do things like run a centralized government or invent an internal combustion engine (another thing the low temperature and atmospheric composition of Avalon would render problematic), you need people who have time to devote to such things instead of going out hunting. If everybody's putting all their energy into getting food (and they would be if all their food comes from hunting), no-one will have time to sit down and tinker until they invent algebra. No farming probably means no civilization.

The thing with fire is that it does require oxygen specifically, it requires an oxidizer. Theoretically they could use something like chlorine or maybe even fluorine as an oxidizer. Maybe using some sort of process to remove chlorine from salt. Then to pump it into an airtight chamber full of flammable material and to have a crucible directly above that. One should be capable of looking up a list of oxidizers and go from there. Keep up the good work.