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(05-24-2017, 03:22 PM)Lost Rinoah Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-23-2017, 03:30 PM)Surge Wrote: [ -> ]I care Sad

as should anybody, otherwise there will be another cross-genre push that will irritate a lot of players of some other genre because they want their perfect RTS or TBS in other games.

Generally the issue isn't going backwards.  (As some games catering to classics is okay)  It's trying to appeal to two contradicting demographics or styles of game-play that just don't work together.  That's the issue.  It splits the focus and ends up with two unpolished sections of what is supposed to be a single game, where nothing works anymore because of it.  "Splitting your attention and resources."  "Running yourself thin."  Etcetra.

And thanks, I'll be sure to smile at him once for you.





Good luck shaad.  I'll likely always still be here to scare you away again.
I think the games that do "classics" best are the ones that recognize the difference between a technological limitation and an active design choice. Let's take Total Annihilation as an example, the notoriously awful pathfinding and wonky hitboxes were a technological limitation, the over the top roster of niche units was an active choice though, so long as TA's successors fixate on a "100% tournament viable" roster of units they'll keep missing the magic that made TA fun imo.
(05-24-2017, 03:36 PM)Surge Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-24-2017, 03:22 PM)Lost Rinoah Wrote: [ -> ]as should anybody, otherwise there will be another cross-genre push that will irritate a lot of players of some other genre because they want their perfect RTS or TBS in other games.

Generally the issue isn't going backwards.  (As some games catering to classics is okay)  It's trying to appeal to two contradicting demographics or styles of game-play that just don't work together.  That's the issue.  It splits the focus and ends up with two unpolished sections of what is supposed to be a single game, where nothing works anymore because of it.  "Splitting your attention and resources."  "Running yourself thin."  Etcetra.

And thanks, I'll be sure to smile at him once for you.






Good luck shaad.  I'll likely always still be here to scare you away again.
I think the games that do "classics" best are the ones that recognize the difference between a technological limitation and an active design choice. Let's take Total Annihilation as an example, the notoriously awful pathfinding and wonky hitboxes were a technological limitation, the over the top roster of niche units was an active choice though, so long as TA's successors fixate on a "100% tournament viable" roster of units they'll keep missing the magic that made TA fun imo.
That's still a dev trying to splice.  combine two different things that don't exactly mesh well without polishing them extra.  But I actually agree.  The devs don't need to focus on tournament balance.  Just "general balance" and polish.  If there's going to be a tourney they'll do the same thing they always did.  Ban the "most OP thing" from being allowed to use in tourneys or you instantly resign your position in said tourney to the runner up.  THey do it all the time in fighting games.  That's why fighting games will always have OP characters.  Devs know they can get away with that and do crazy shit without ruining it for anyone that matters.  RTS devs seem to have an issue with not having fun developing their games anymore. 

Where's the magic of three guys yelling at each other in a office far too small to fit even two people as they create games like starcraft and TA.  Stealing whale figures from each other's desks as an office game that's gone on for 22 years.  And having your bosses say things completely opposite of each other to you.  "Make them taller and thinner"  and "make them shorter and wider".
(05-24-2017, 11:28 AM)Surge Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-24-2017, 11:16 AM)SCN-3_NULL Wrote: [ -> ]it's complete utter chaos, yep....I was there too, but atleast  whenever I'm around everything cooled down alot

chaos? what?
remember the good old days for like 100pagex20posts days, kinda like that except in discord form with all those channels
(05-24-2017, 05:54 PM)SCN-3_NULL Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-24-2017, 11:28 AM)Surge Wrote: [ -> ]chaos? what?
remember the good old days for like 100pagex20posts days, kinda like that except in discord form with all those channels
Uh, okay I guess.
I can't not share this remix
[+]
(05-24-2017, 03:49 PM)Lost Rinoah Wrote: [ -> ]RTS devs seem to have an issue with not having fun developing their games anymore. 

Where's the magic of three guys yelling at each other in a office far too small to fit even two people as they create games like starcraft and TA.  Stealing whale figures from each other's desks as an office game that's gone on for 22 years.  And having your bosses say things completely opposite of each other to you.  "Make them taller and thinner"  and "make them shorter and wider".
That's not fun lol, that's horrendously stressful working conditions
(05-25-2017, 01:47 AM)Segolia Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-24-2017, 03:49 PM)Lost Rinoah Wrote: [ -> ]RTS devs seem to have an issue with not having fun developing their games anymore. 

Where's the magic of three guys yelling at each other in a office far too small to fit even two people as they create games like starcraft and TA.  Stealing whale figures from each other's desks as an office game that's gone on for 22 years.  And having your bosses say things completely opposite of each other to you.  "Make them taller and thinner"  and "make them shorter and wider".
That's not fun lol, that's horrendously stressful working conditions

Exactly.  No pain no game.
(05-25-2017, 08:53 PM)Lost Rinoah Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-25-2017, 01:47 AM)Segolia Wrote: [ -> ]That's not fun lol, that's horrendously stressful working conditions

Exactly.  No pain no game.

Oooor we could re-evaluate a harmful and exploitative industry culture which takes advantage of people's love for games by working them to death by paying game developers fairly and giving them a more reasonable workload?
On a totally unrelated note
(05-26-2017, 12:06 AM)Surge Wrote: [ -> ]On a totally unrelated note

Doom marine sound effect?
(05-26-2017, 03:06 AM)SCN-3_NULL Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-26-2017, 12:06 AM)Surge Wrote: [ -> ]On a totally unrelated note

Doom marine sound effect?
I'm actually not using anything as an explicit reference, I've consulted a few things for design cues and hints (Halo and a cyberpunk artist I follow on weasyl) but mostly I've been feeling the design through totally freeform.
[Image: new_reks_vali_colored_by_reksanden-dbaee2u.png]

Redesigned my old 'vali.

Rather, personalized it to current times, as the old one is more of her own character.
The discord called us dead :/
Prep the meme Jihad
I mean they aren't particularly wrong.
(05-26-2017, 07:28 PM)achroma Wrote: [ -> ]The discord called us dead :/
Prep the meme Jihad

They only somewhat right. We're very slow and with no new people really joining. But we aren't truly dead till there is no activity what so ever. So let's do something about it. Or not I don't care.



me_irl
truly TF2 animations are god's gift to man.
(05-26-2017, 07:28 PM)achroma Wrote: [ -> ]The discord called us dead :/
Prep the meme Jihad

did some say Jihad
[Image: 048.gif]







(05-25-2017, 11:14 PM)Segolia Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-25-2017, 08:53 PM)Lost Rinoah Wrote: [ -> ]Exactly.  No pain no game.

Oooor we could re-evaluate a harmful and exploitative industry culture which takes advantage of people's love for games by working them to death by paying game developers fairly and giving them a more reasonable workload?

But I was already leading into that bit with what I was saying, just maintaining an air of levity.  The real issue is that originally it was a self imposed situation.  Not some "You do all this or you lose your job!  And probably lose it after you finish anyways!"  It was "Hey, i'm passionate about my work here, so i'll go through anything to finish this game!"  That classic stressful situation.  Now?  Well, now companies are trying to use that as a "standard example" for some stupid reason.  For workers who are not passionate about their job because the game was developed by committee to appeal to as broad of an audience as they can.  IE, increase profits.  It's not something they are allowed to have much or any say on.  And they're going to get fired to save money when the game is finished anyways.  Then rehired somewhere else for the exact same thing.  To get fired when the game is finished to save money again.  What a wonderful world of game development it is for AAA titles. I mean, christ, Non disclosure agreements that won't allow you to talk about work conditions or the conditions of your contract even after the contract expires with your job..
(05-27-2017, 06:50 PM)Lost Rinoah Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-25-2017, 11:14 PM)Segolia Wrote: [ -> ]Oooor we could re-evaluate a harmful and exploitative industry culture which takes advantage of people's love for games by working them to death by paying game developers fairly and giving them a more reasonable workload?

But I was already leading into that bit with what I was saying, just maintaining an air of levity.  The real issue is that originally it was a self imposed situation.  Not some "You do all this or you lose your job!  And probably lose it after you finish anyways!"  It was "Hey, i'm passionate about my work here, so i'll go through anything to finish this game!"  That classic stressful situation.  Now?  Well, now companies are trying to use that as a "standard example" for some stupid reason.  For workers who are not passionate about their job because the game was developed by committee to appeal to as broad of an audience as they can.  IE, increase profits.  It's not something they are allowed to have much or any say on.  And they're going to get fired to save money when the game is finished anyways.  Then rehired somewhere else for the exact same thing.  To get fired when the game is finished to save money again.  What a wonderful world of game development it is for AAA titles.  I mean, christ, Non disclosure agreements that won't allow you to talk about work conditions or the conditions of your contract even after the contract expires with your job..
Not surprised. Business has always had that what's the most I can get out of workers by giving them as little as possible thing going on. At least some people try to stop it (key word TRY humans are dicks they can be as awesome as they can be evil).